Parrot Secrets
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Let’s face it, the economy is in trouble and so are the rest of us. Based on the dregs I find in my spam filter that makes this a hot season for folks selling plans for how to make big money on the Internet – plans that mostly aren’t worth what people pay for them. Either these advertised sites are simply scams or they are promoting the obvious — often free government web sites that diligent folks could find on their own. But that doesn’t mean there aren’t legitimate Internet businesses that can be started on a shoestring. So to do my part for the economy I’m going to offer-up what I have always considered to be the cleverest little Internet business of all: www.parrotsecrets.com.
I assume you’ve taken a look at the site and are back now. What makes Parrotsecrets so great? It doesn’t look like much, does it? I’m sure there are a thousand – maybe 10,000 – very similar sites on the net right now. And that’s the point: there is plenty of opportunity to replicate this model.
Before I lose you here’s the literal bottom line on Parrotsecrets. The site sells 15-20 eBook sets per day seven days per week. Using the low end of that range is 5,475 copies per year for gross sales of $437,726.25 from a web site that costs less than $10 per month.
The profit on Parrotsecrets, even after various expenses I’ll detail below, is WAY north of $400,000 per year.
Could you live on that?
Me too.
The thing I love the most about Parrotsecrets is not the great money but that it actually serves a need. People really do have problems with their parrots and there isn’t that much information out there about how to train and care for parrots that is in an easily accessible form. Parrotsecrets not only isn’t a scam, it isn’t even a waste of money. This is a real business doing real good for real customers.
Parrots are apparently a huge financial drain and $79.95 is nothing to pay if it saves a vet visit per year and keeps you from losing a fingertip or having your parrot call Grandma a whore.
The first thing that’s remarkable about Parrotsecrets is how it came about. The owner of Parrotsecrets, for one thing, doesn’t even own a parrot. Rather, the owner set out to find a niche in the information economy that could be filled with eBooks as sold here. The first step in the development of Parrotsecrets, then, was to identify the frustration of Parrot owners.
I’m not going into the fine details of how parrots were isolated as a subject, but it involved a lot of scanning discussion forums and looking for unrequited Google searches. In time it became clear to the entrepreneur that parrots were an untapped market. If you were to undertake something similar you could either isolate a topic you actually know a lot about (either as a master or a victim) or go searching like the Parrotsecrets owner did. Either way, I’m sure you’d soon come up with a topic.
The young and lovely Mrs. Cringely has a particular health problem she darned well doesn’t want me to reveal to anyone including you that I have figured is perfect for the Parrotsecrets treatment. I’ve been urging her to move forward on her own but she just won’t. So if I ever get a weekend off (I’ve waited over a decade so far, which makes that unlikely) I’ll write the darned eBook myself and retire.
eBooks have no manufacturing costs, no inventory costs, and almost no distribution costs. Best of all, it is a GLOBAL business. People are having trouble with their parrots everywhere, you know, not just in the U.S., and Parrotsecrets can deliver anywhere.
But first you must have something to deliver. Having identified a topic, the founder of Parrotsecrets needed an eBook. The easiest way to do this was to post the requirement on one or more of the many freelancing web sites. Writers bid on the job and the original eBook (note there are now four eBooks in the offer) went for around $2500, deliverable in 30 days.
The Parrotsecrets founder ordered from Amazon.com every book on parrots (deliverable to the winning freelancer) then waited a month for the eBook to appear.
That month was used to buy the domain, design the web site, prepare a Google AdWords campaign, and be ready to be up and running as soon as the eBook was finished.
If you’ve been keeping track you can see that starting this business cost substantially under $10,000 and probably under $5,000. The Kauffman Foundation on Entrepreneurism says 95 percent of small businesses are started for less than $10,000. This is one of those.
The web site follows a popular design philosophy. It is a single page that scrolls on and on forever, pounding the reader with testimonials and reason upon reason for buying the eBooks. These characteristics have shown themselves to be very persuasive with the Parrotsecrets target audience, which are older women stuck with (or thinking about getting) naughty parrots. That’s why the figurehead for Parrotsecrets is Nathalie Roberts (“A Parrot Lover For The Last 12 Years”).
Nathalie (“A Parrot Lover For The Last 12 Years”) looks like someone we can trust.
Nathalie also doesn’t exist.
Nathalie Roberts (“A Parrot Lover For The Last 12 Years”) is like Betty Crocker – a character created to market a product. If you are offended by the idea that Nathalie isn’t real, then start boycotting cake mixes, kids.
EVERYTHING about Parrotsecrets is calculated. Nothing is left to chance. The site is promoted by word-of-mouth (remember it performs a real service) and with Google AdWords. Of course AdWords can kill you if you aren’t careful and that’s part of the reason why parrots were chosen in the first place: there simply isn’t that much competition for the word “parrot.”
According to the Internet Archive’s Wayback Machine, Parrotsecrets has been around since May, 2004 or almost five years, during which it has generated more than $2 million for its owner.
The owner of Parrotsecrets isn’t Nathalie Roberts, isn’t even a woman, and isn’t even American. He’s Indian and lives in India. When Parrotsecrets began he lived (and still lives as far as I know) with his parents, who are both medical doctors. When the site started in 2004 he was 18 years old, making him 23 today.
Parrotsecrets doesn’t run on autopilot. The owner has invested continually in improving the product adding eBooks and free extras to improve the appeal of his product. He (or someone) corresponds with his customers using e-mail. But given that the service is coming primarily from India you can imagine that his continuing costs are quite low.
Imagine what it would be like to make $400,000+ per year. Now imagine what it would be like to be 23, single, living in India, making $400,000+ per year. And Parrotsecrets is not his only web site.
I have known about Parrotsecrets since 2005 when I met the owner in Las Vegas, of all places (a surreal experience — an Indian teenage tycoon on his first-ever visit to America starts with Vegas). In one sense I didn’t want to blow his cover because it is so cleverly drawn. But now I can see the need for a lot of smart people to make a new living as they lose their jobs. I’ve also rationalized that this column may actually drive business his way, not just from parrot owners but also from entrepreneurs who want good examples of a product to emulate.
Go forth and multiply. May the Parrotsecrets be with you.
[...] Cringely’s article: Parrot Secrets Posted in Case study [...]
it never fails to amaze me how well a one page website can do. You should have jumped on his revenue train and used an affiliate link.
Thanks Bob.This is a much better story than anything Thomas Friedman* has come up with.
After reading Chomsky, Naomi* and listening to Jon Stewart (bash CNBC) I was getting a little disillusioned with our corporations (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3969792790081230711&hl=en)
The neocons misrepresent our situation was a result of a financial bubble:( http://www.theatlantic.com/doc/200812/financial-bubbles )
Bank regualtions force the banks to end their ponzi sheme:
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/13/business/economy/13norris.html?_r=2
This is funnier than anything Friedman/Cramer has wrote: “Mark-to-market accounting is the principal reason why our financial system is in a meltdown,” – Steve Forbes/Wall Street Journal
OOPs:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3969792790081230711&hl=en
*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvG0gbvZ4tY
I don’t know why people are so down on this guy. He’s fulfilling some sort of need. And, in the process, he’s making a bit of money. He’s not spamming. He’s not selling male or female “enhancers” that don’t work. And, he has lots of happy customers.
What Bob has shown is what went into an apparently simple website and how much money it can really generate. The owner of the site did lots of research. He gathered the needed adwords. He put everything together, and he’s still working on his website to make sure it is still relevant.
Maybe I have a few minor ethical issues. Did he really have a friend whose parrot said “Give me pot seeds?” But, on the whole, he’s on the up-and-up.
I know someone who controls over 40,000 web domains. What does he do with these domains? Absolutely nothing. He provides no content at all. They are simply landing pages for people who mistype a web address. He pays about $3 per year for each one, and by people accidentally landing on these pages, he earns a few million a year in referrals.
To me, this is worse than the parrot guy. This Master of his Domains does nothing but makes gobs of money off of other people’s typing errors. His domains renew automatically, and he never bothers with answering email or any inquiries into even selling the domains he controls. If you want one of the domains he controls, tough. He’ll never give them up and he’ll never sell any of them. That would require doing something other than sitting on his duff and watching TV. Occasionally, he “expands” his business by acquiring a bunch of other domains, but that’s it. A leach on our society and a destroyer of the value of the Internet.
Dammit, why didn’t I think of this first?
Hi Dave, How do you about this guy who controls so many websites and earns alot. I need more information about that business (!) for my college research. Thanks!
This is part of your statement as a reminder: “I know someone who controls over 40,000 web domains. What does he do with these domains? Absolutely nothing. He provides no content at all. They are simply landing pages for people who mistype a web address. He pays about $3 per year for each one, and by people accidentally landing on these pages, he earns a few million a year in referrals.”
What an unfortunate example of a system that works. ( “Works” defined as “makes lots of money.”)
1. I am so glad for the future of our world economy (and human race) to see so many people agree that this system of lying is unethical. One of the reasons our global economy is in the dumps right now is because of unethical manipulations of our financial systems. It’s because there are some people out there who will emulate Madoff, Enron … because their schemes “work” – just don’t get caught like them and eventually, like this Indian kid.
2. One comment from one who liked this scheme also said, “I agree that there are dangerous elements in our society that must be identified and removed, but a parrot book????”
What if there were a “Secrets to an Obedient Dog” book that caused owners to give up their dogs to pounds because the advice did not solve the dog’s biting problems or exacerbated it. These people bought the book because of the (fake) testimonials but now feel they are failures because they can’t apply the advice that works for everyone else, and feel their dog is a failure because it has something fundamentally wrong with it and can’t be taught anything.
Well, Josh, let me tell you about a rescue/sanctuary for parrots with over 400 unwanted parrots, spending the rest of its 60-100 year life in cages, row upon row. This sanctuary is in need of money to build aviaries so they may be able to come out of their 3′x3′ cages to fly a little. There are sanctuaries all over the US turning away unwanted birds for lack of space. Parrots are going the way of puppy mills and dog shelters.
Yes, Bob, you can make great money selling ebooks to people who don’t know how to do their own research. But please find an ethical example to share. This one actually tells people to cure their parrot’s biting by “moving your hand into the bite.” Can you imagine doing that with a dog? This kind of training will either intimidate the dog into being submissive (bad training) or enrage it into aggression (bad training). Maybe we give the kid the benefit of the doubt that he believes he is giving good advise. Well, too bad – it is canceled out by the false testimonials. Yep, there are old ladies who desperately need parrot advise. Let them be scammed. and yep, there are real professionals out there – let them be scammed by repackaging their work without giving them mention, no bibliography. What do you need facts and professionals when there’s the marketing tool of false testimony and Bob’s stamp of approval? This system “works”!
Mandy Andrea
Ugh.
I was really excited you’d found something that entrepreneurs could do to bring value to the world. But this guy’s taken the basics somebody could get from any $20 parrot book, added a heap of the sort of dubious marketing that fills the low-grade tabloids, thrown in a web forum they could get for free, and charged $80 for it.
From an economic perspective — which is something we clearly could use more of — this business adds little or no value to the world. All it does is extract money from people who aren’t smart enough to find the right parrot book through Amazon or their local pet store. It moves money around, but it makes us net poorer, as it consumes more value than it creates.
I’m sure it’s great for the guy running it, but don’t fool yourself into thinking this does anything good for our economy at all.
Sorry to disappoint you but if you’ll get off your egalitarian soap box for a moment maybe you’ll notice there are people out of work out there.
This is hardly elegant, no, which is exactly why I like it — because it is so darned doable as a business model.
If it can be accomplished for less money then people should (and will) find that alternative. Those who didn’t find your preferred alternative seem satisfied with this, which is why there are all types of shampoo at all price points for all sorts of consumers.
Bob
Hi Robert,
I’d interested in hearing your refutation of William’s argument about not doing any good for our economy. Mentioning that there are people being out of work is hardly a counter-argument. Not that I fully agree with William, but he certainly made a valid point that many of us overlook with haste.
I think your shampoo analogy misses the mark for two reasons. The obvious one is that shampoo purchases are ongoing, so there’s more reason to believe that people buy in line with value. In other words, having tried both cheap and expensive shampoos, somebody will keep buying an expensive one because they believe it’s worth it. That’s different than hit-and-run marketing like this.
More importantly, though, you’re saying that because for some products marketing is being used to extract cash out of proportion to your idea of value, it’s a good idea for everybody to do that. That’s not a small error; it’s giant.
Given the amount of acuity I’ve seen you display over the years since I picked up Accidental Empires, I’m shocked that you are missing one of the fundamental causes of this crisis: people stopped caring about creating or delivering value, and focused purely on cash extraction, damn the consequences. And then we celebrated those people because we assumed, like Madoff’s victims did, that their wealth was a sign of real success.
Promoting borderline scams like this isn’t making things better; it’s spreading the disease that has made us so sick.
It seems hard for many of you to believe that ParrotSecrets.com is helping the economy. What is the economy? It is people serving one another’s needs — our needs for food, shelter, and even seemingly small desires such as having a happy parrot.
There are apparently thousands of people per year that find ParrotSecrets.com to provide a useful service. Of course this information is probably available elsewhere, but why complain that some people would rather pay $79 than spend more time researching? If you want to save those people money $79, then create your own website to compete with ParrotSecrets.com. It’s a free market, with people making voluntary exchanges.
Thanks Bob for this fine example of entrepreneurship. It’s all about serving the needs and desires of real people, pet owners included.
Jim, it’s not helping the economy at all. The fair market value of a book of parrot advice is circa $20. If people pay $80 for that because of clever marketing and a dubious return policy, then they are $60 poorer than they should be.
You talk up the free market, but this guy is actually avoiding the marketplace by selling his books this way. Putting the books on Amazon would be a real free market, one with true competition and a level playing field. Why doesn’t he do that? Probably because a book written by a ghost writer, who as far as we know doesn’t even own a parrot, wouldn’t get very good reviews.
Sure, it’s a free country, and that guy’s legally allowed to use dubious marketing techniques to get easily led people to overpay for a book of parrot advice of unknown value. But that doesn’t mean I have to like it, and that something is legal doesn’t make it a good idea, or good for society.
William ~ who is determines the ‘market value’? I thought it was the market. You know, the people who want the type of product being sold…
Is Amazon the only market for information? NO note even close.
Doug, you should go read up on “fair market value”. It’s a technical term from economics, and $80 is not the fair market value for even a good book of parrot advice, let alone a dubious one.
The Fair Market value is what someone is willing to pay for it.
Think about Kellogg’s corn flakes? How much money are they work? 4 dollars a box? Does it cost them 4 dollars a box to manufacture?
You can fool some of the people all the time, those are where your margins are!
So, erm, the idea is that because the economy has imploded, it is okay to lie for money?
False testimonials are illegal in many countries, by the way.
His parrot biz solves problems for people that have parrots . He is smart and he is making money for himself .. that is all that matters, I wouldn’t waste time over analyzing the article .. The message is clear .. You too can make money if you want to .
You can also sell heroin to kids.
You can also be a dope. (Which apparently you’ve already achieved. I’d bet a few large that you have never done any of the following, started a real company, employed anyone full time including yourself, or gotten laid in the last 30 days).
BornRighteous, that’s funny!!!
Everyone, take a deep breath! It’s a book…and you don’t have to buy it.
Are you going to give Tim Ferris shit for telling you things that, let’s say, Dan Kennedy’s already said in his books?
How many self-help books say the same thing over and over, but people keep buying them hoping for the answers. In the end, it’s getting of your butt and doing something.
AND if reading that just pissed you off, you should buy “You Can Heal You Life” by Louise L. Hay.
Bye bye.
Following this model, you would suggest we all pick a niche market, identify ourselves as someone we are not, with experience and expertise we don’t have and sell products to people who, by the very nature of the market – would find it difficult if not impossible to know the truth.
Have I missed anything yet? At what point is this just fraud? We have a teenager from India, claiming to be someone else with experience who then fed search engines cross references to legitimize his standing (or more specifically Nathalie Roberts).
Is it possible this person knows more than the supposed middle aged parrot lover with 12 years experience? Certainly. However, he decided that was not enough – based on your coverage, because he did not have that experience. Instead he lied to everyone(creating a false impression IS a lie) and then charged them for what he culled from the newsgroups. Am I missing anything yet?
So – instead of identifying expertise and raising it above the clatter of the girl “who would love to talk to me now” and the “banker from Africa – who can make me millions,” I am stuck with more liars working to get money from me.
This IS the problem with the Internet. Scams and cheats and liars outnumber legitimate businesses and make it nearly impossible for us to fill a niche market. Why? Because when I sell my services I want to be around next year so I cannot make claims that are going to ruin me. This is a get rich quick – buyer beware scheme.
Do I want to make $400,000 – YES! Is it fair if I lose to my competition? YES, just as the converse is true. But is it fair to poison the customer pool – to focus people only on the “BIG GUYS” because a guy like this makes everyone twice as hesitant to deal with anyone but an Amazon, Walmart or Buy?
Do legitimate small internet businesses a favor – identify these people – drive them out of business because they are the snake oil salesmen of our time. And they are ruining it for the rest of us.
Yes, Mike, I would have you do all those things and here’s why: I have yet to find people bitching and moaning on the Internet about being cheated by Parrotsecrets.
We have in the Internet a remarkable self-policing system of commerce. If there’s a company you are about to do business with you can check very quickly and find out if other people are unhappy with their service. NOBODY is complaining about Parrotsecrets.
All the things that you are loathe to do to promote the site are what MOST sites do to promote themselves. Do you think all those attractive boys and girls on web pages actually work at the companies they advertise? That’s exactly my point about Betty Crocker.
What matters is how the cake tastes
So you can get all huffy because that’s what you like to do, I’m guessing. In which case I suppose I’ve made you very happy.
Bob
It took me about 10 seconds to find someone who claims to have been scammed:
http://nancyrichards.org/
Robert – it would give you a lot of credibility if you answered this comment about the scam. It seems like the guy people parrotsecrets has been screwing over people. I for one think there is nothing wrong with the business model, the execution or anything else. I am all for this type of entrepreneurship. But I draw a line at fraud, and it really looks like this is all one big scam. It’s serious enough that there are websites devoted to exposing his scams!
You stated that nobody is complaining about ParrotSecrets.com? Go to the Better Business Bureau and type in ParrotSecrets.com and you will see a rating of “F” due to the lack of the businesses response to complaints.
http://westflorida.bbb.org/WWWRoot/Report.aspx?site=47&bbb=0653&firm=90039494
Before anyone does any purchasing of anything over the internet it is a good practice to look them up at the BBB.
OMG ! … I guess you don’t know anything about marketing … Maybe you should go read the book All Marketers are Liars ..
What we as consumers care about is the end result .. There is nothing illegal about what he has done …in fact I wont be surprised if Mike Gamerland is not your real name ..but I don’t care . I don’t see it as deception .. I am only concerned about the comment that you wrote ..
That something is currently legal doesn’t make it right, or even necessarily a good idea.
Hm. The site seems to be cringelyed. I *hope* that it is just legitimate traffic generated by this article, and not some DDOS from a shakedown crew in the RBN sniffing out the big money. If it is the latter, maybe you should think twice about promoting things you like..maybe Neokast would still be around if you hadn’t blown some egos out of proportion.. Bob, be wary of the power you wield.
First: Bob, thank you for the article. It reveals a true business model based on the internet that can be run by an individual, or a small group of people. After looking at the site, I am amazed that he can draw so much money with such a simple looking website. I wish you as much sucess with your mortgage business (and your foil hard drive business?)
Second: Wow. I am honestly quite shocked by the innocence of the first few commentators. The advertising industry draws BILLIONS of dollars promoting products as hip, cool, stable, healthy, dangerous, etc. In 2007, nearly 150 Billion dollars was spent in the US alone to promote ideas, services, dogma, etc. This money is spent because research shows that it works. If it didn’t, then advertising is the real scam. Advertising elects most politicians including the current administration. Barak Obama is a figure-head, an ambassador, a spokesmen for the people with the real power in this country. That pretty boy that sells Banana Republic sweaters and that sexy woman that sell’s “Victoria’s” underwear are paid actors/models. They have no investment in the company.
A bright young man does a market analysis, buys research, repackages the results, and fills a market demand (in addition to doing some reading on advertising, the critical ones should also do some reading on setting up a successful business). If his work is so much fraud or he is overcharging his customers, then eventually someone else will create another similar work and sell it for less…isn’t that the concept of competition in the market?
Perhaps what we need is a government agency to moderate new businesses that take advantage of unsuspecting customers. Every new business would have to be approved first, thereby restricting the right to individual speech, the right to individual prosperity, the write to self-determination, etc. — It is incomplete reasoning along these lines that is moving society to hand over personal freedoms of the masses to the governments for the sake of protection from all types of “unwanted people” and “dangerous ideas”. I agree that there are dangerous elements in our society that must be identified and removed, but a parrot book????
Third: Sorry for going off there, however I have much more inside that I contained. I hope I didn’t offend anyone, but the out-spoken Mike and William didn’t seem to worry about taking a few jabs. Hope this doesn’t turn into a flame-fest Bob.
Interesting read there Bob. I’ve seen a few sites like this when searching for things in the past. My favorite was one that could cure acid reflux indigestion by eating a particular brand of Apple once a day. The catch was that you had to buy the book to find out.
It seems like a quick easy way to attain a high income. My only doubt about these sites is that I don’t think they are all as above board as Parrot Secrets. Perhaps there is a gap in the market for a site which tests these e-books to see if their advice is worthwhile and recommends them to readers. Imagine how much you could make from an e-book if it was reviewed and certified as ok.
Man, that’s one long friggin page. Wow.
Gotta give it to the kid, he did his research and is being rewarded.
Bob, you’ve written some great things in your day– but this may be the best yet! And it will surely get you a ton of traffic.
The only bad thing about it is you’ve taken away a big chunk of excuses many of us could use for not getting rich! Ha, ha.
Now I’ve got to put my thinking cap on and figure out what my own form of parrotsecrets.com could be…
Thanks Bob!
OK, so this seems legitimate, but a quick Goggle search for “parrotsecrets.com scam” gives the top result as:
http://nancyrichards.org/
which claims the site is a scam. Are they jealous, or is there something in it?
It looks like Bob was wrong. There is a whole ‘net subculture that’s angry and dissatisfied with parrotsecrets.
Hi Joe,
Irrespective of motives (jealousy, anger, grudge) – it should be real easy to read a bit on our site and find out for yourself what the truth is about Sumantra Roy who owns http://www.parrotsecrets.com.
The only question left is if someone who sells memberships for $37 to $67 to a site that doesn’t exist is a scammer or not.
Regards
Sorry Bob, but your comment that “NOBODY is complaining about Parrotsecrets”, is a bit off the mark. People have had trouble with his “120 day money back” refund. Hidden in the fine print after you you purchase his “product”, he gives an address in India that you must write to (by snail mail), to get a refund. The majority of his clients are probably too embarrassed to make a fuss and complain. Bird forums *are* squawking (sorry) about it… http://www.birdboard.com/forum/parrotlets/23007-has-any-one-heard.html, http://talkparrotlets.com/showthread.php?t=2247.
But what I thought was really interesting was a site that allows you to try a ‘product’ like parrotsecrets by buying it through them and then promises you a refund through them if you find the product lacking. http://suckered.org/st-parrotsec.html Wonder how legit this site is.
Any time something or someone is misrepresented, it’s a recipe for trouble. If you’re an expert in something, fine, write an eBook and sell it on the Internet. Hiding behind a fake persona will always be exposed in the long run. His information may be on the mark, but authenticity counts for much when dealing with customers.
One small cost for touting a fundamentally dishonest business and marketing model is my respect for your opinion. You likely won’t miss it because you didn’t even know you had it but gauging by the comments you’ve lost the respect of others tool. And, well, small costs add up.
Yes, the use of fake names and fake testimonials have a long history of successfully parting fools from their money. That doesn’t make them any less dishonest.
Parrots for Dummies in paperback $16.99
http://tinyurl.com/bknjje
Bwahahhahahahhaaha .. So you think all the celebrities that get paid millions to endorse those product actually use them … ROTFLMMFAO
This is marketing …. Marketing at its best … This is what business is all about
The guy even has a money back guarantee
“Take 120 days to read through all the material. If you are not satisfied with the helpful knowledge shared in my book, just contact me during that time, and I will promptly return your money, no questions asked.”
…Except the “me” doesn’t exist, and from the feedback out there, apparently the money-back guarantee is slightly slippery, to say the least.
Can you snake-oil salesmen kindly go pick some crabapples and sell them on the side of the road or something? Can we actually have an economy that functions based on production rather than Peter borrowing from Paul at an adjustable interest rate, and Paul selling a CDO based on the loan, and Saul giving it an AAA rating despite the fact that Peter doesn’t have enough money to buy a toaster much less pay back Paul?
Signed, Everyone Who’s Not an Idiot But is Paying For Your Worthlessness Anyway
…but he is not doing anything different from what other big companies are doing .. This is what business is about ?
…. except that when you try to get your money back, they say they’ll send you a key to your memberhip site again. And when you insist on getting your money back you’ll have to explain and get into an argument. In the end you’ll have to write a letter to India. Most people don’t believe, in this day and age, that THAT is going to work and give up. It is business at the edge, not to mention that the products are bogus. Read more on our site.
I’m trying really hard not to act like a sermonizing hypocrite, but my God… This is like 1 step away from buying HUNDREDS OF TINY CLASSIFIED ADS as recommended by Don LePre.
No, that’s EXACTLY what this is… Not that there’s anything wrong that…
I think the article is brilliant .. Some people just don’t understand business …
Do you think the Jeep Cherokee can actually climb mountains or do you think that if you get that Harvard MBA you will instantly earn 6 figures ? Do you really think you will actually run faster because you are wearing Nike .. How about the proactive advert ? Do you think all those celebrities use Proactive ?
This is business … The parrot guy has 100% money back guarantee … I love the article and its not meant for everybody .. Look at the advert for a cruise company .. they sell you on the idea that you will be in paradise .. WAKE UP People … This is BUSINESS as usual !
His money back policy requires a hand written e-mail to India! C’mon now… let’s get real. There is a lot to like about this type of venture, but a lot to dislike about it if its a fraud and scamming people.
A hand written email to India? Are you serious?!
“I was extremely dissatisfied with the book; I would like my money back please.”
Writing an email is barely hard, much less complex.
Sorry, that was a typo in my comment. It’s a letter to Calcutta, India… not an e-mail. Original snail mail. To get the snail mail address, you first have to e-mail them. There are numerous mentions on the web where people have not even received the product for the original price, much less a refund.
As mentioned earlier I am not against the biz model that this guy implemented. But as soon as you start scamming people, that’s not cool.
damn is that website ugly!
ok, i’m cool with selling a needed product… but i’m not cool about the dishonest way of marketing it. i know marketing can be a shady business, but shouldn’t we strive to rise above that?
what’s wrong with coming right out and saying, ‘i’ve talked with many frustrated parrot owners, and decided to do something about it! i bought a bunch of books about parrots and now they’re compiled into my helpful ebook on sale now.’ etc…
Marketing at its best.
This “kid from India” does a lot more than just host a $10 a month website, guys.
If you look deep into what he is doing and how he is accomplishing it, you will be blown away.
I am sure he has many more websites, too.
His company employs 30 full-time professionals — that’s not something you do from your basement or garage.
- Michael
P.S. RE: LadyAngora — most marketing is shady. If you know *a lot* about any one product, you can break it down and basically say their entire marketing dept. is full of empty promises. Creating very niche information products (aggregating a lot of information into a cliff-note style download) is exactly what he is doing, as you said, but people don’t really want to know that all the information they need is readily available (for free) from the local library.
[...] Роберту Кринджли, сайт довольно успешно делает в год более $400,000, продавая электронную книгу за $79.95. Автор купил на [...]
Right.
Yes, the trick, if you use Google AdWords, is to specialize in some niche NOBODY is patronizing, buy the words, the website, and keep it simple and don’t be too high and mighty not use e-mail spam lists. People DO read some spam, if it piques their curiosity enough.
BTW, though Google is the eighteen hundred ton sperm whale in the room, what are ad word rates like on Yahoo’s and MSN’ Live search engines (and Ask.com, while I’m at it)? It must be cheaper to advertise on those search engines than on Google right?
(When I visited parrotsecrets I got a pop-up that promised as a special new customer a one time offer price of $39.95 and was promised this was one time and would not be offered this again. This guy has got it down to a science.)
Bob- What’s wrong? Did my first post fail to pass moderation just because I pointed out a little lack of thoroughness in researching your assertions?
Interesting and surprising story. Assuming the numbers you mention are correct, this is indeed a big success. I skimmed through this website and I am now quite sure that most of the clients are Americans though…
[...] Robert X. Cringely would like us all to know that what the business world needs is more bullshit. [...]
…and this is *exactly* why the US (and by default the rest of the world) is in this economic mess today. This assumption that successful business is defined solely by the amount of dollars/profit earned, while ignoring the methodology has been the excuse for the Wall St excesses, ponzi schemes, junk bonds and every other get rich quick scheme ever to surface in the past decades.
People have got to get away from this ’something for nothing’ value system, and start producing real wealth and real value, otherwise we’re all sunk. Sure a plagiarised parrot e-book is a product of sorts, in the same way a packaged CDO is a product, but what value has it really created for society?
Bob will claim that this is high horse territory, but really it boils down to a simple question. Is it better to help people conduct elaborate quasi-legitimate scams online, or teach them how to establish, run and build sustainable, long term businesses which add real value to society?
Why does corruption, laziness or naked greed have to be a part of the process? I’m not being naive about the Industrial Revolution or previous bubbles, but surely in the 21st century we can start to think more maturely about where we want to go with our economic infrastructure? Or must we continue to repeat the mistakes of the past ad nauseum?
I know which side Bob is on now, but I’m going to stick to trying to do business in a more responsible way. Unfortunately that makes me a sap according to Bob’s current thinking. So be it.
Wow all the post did was illustrate a very interesting point about a successful business.
While we spend thousonds of Dollars building something that will generate no more then US$ 100.000 a year, a site wich costs only US$ 10/month generates for times our revenue…
A great lesson for us all, no doubt about it!
@Jaggs,
> this is *exactly* why the US (and by default the rest of the world) is in this economic mess today. This assumption that successful business is defined solely by the amount of dollars/profit earned, while ignoring the methodology has been the excuse for the Wall St excesses, ponzi schemes, junk bonds and every other get rich quick scheme ever to surface in the past decades.
This is true. Businesses and individuals should be careful about “get rich schemes”. But how relevant is this argument to the given website? Or Bob’s idea in general?
> Sure a plagiarised parrot e-book is a product of sorts, in the same way a packaged CDO is a product, but what value has it really created for society?
(side question – what is a CDO?)
This is basically the heart of your argument against parrotsecrets. Now, lets say you are 100% true and all those ebooks are, is a bunch of well known facts re-packaged and re-sold for a premium, without adding any value. Even in this case, is Bob’s premise incorrect? If you open an online business that *does* add some value to the niche you choose to go into, isn’t that added value, even if using publicly available information, worth a premium?
parrotsecrets could be total junk. I don’t know, and really I think it matters, with regards to Bob’s main point. I think Bob’s main point is to describe how in the Internet age this guy looked for a need to fill and then proceeded to fill it, cheaply and effectively. He isn’t offering a get rich scheme (well, I’m not sure what his advise for training parrots is… ;p). He’s offering to sell information. Last I heard, there was nothing wrong with selling information. Or even access to a search for more easily finding that information.. /hi Google!
Again, I don’t think you should get too obsessed with the example Bob gave. He gave an example he was familiar with. But there must be thousands, tens of thousands even, of such examples out there. Even if this specific site is totally bogus and a complete scam, selling nothing more than the Wikipedia page on parrots for $80, this still doesn’t invalidate the general idea.
Find a need, and fill it. Only on the Internet, you can do it for very low cost and reach a global audience. Maybe it is a “du’h” mem – but in these times, maybe it’s a “du’h” mem worth repeating.
Now, if only I had a good idea for such a niche…
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collateralized_debt_obligation
I think you captured the real point here. This could be total junk. If it is, it only makes the point that a good product sold and marketed in a similar fashion is even more viable. I have some ideas for content myself.
What your buying here is focused research, not someone’s perspective or opinion from decades of experience. The later has value for sure, but so does research.
–David
@solidstate,
Yes I see your point. I am not disagreeing that the post is highlighting an example, I’m simply saying that the example sucks!
If you want to pick successful business ideas to promote to encourage individual entrepreneurship, then at least pick one with some authentic value. One that is not just built on straw and the desire for a fast buck. That’s why we’re here now with this mess.
But there is hope – http://www.texasforward.org/?p=1762
You don’t have to sacrifice your ethics to make money. What a scumbag business. Shame on you for promoting this kind of crap.
Dealt with a telecommunications company lately?
One point I have not seen discussed are all those testimonials on the site. Are they real responses from real satisfied customers or are they just made up?
If they are all real, then what did the page look like when it first started? Could they have had the success need to generate all those real testimonials if they started out with a page that had no testimonials at all?
Or did they salt the mine with phony testimonials to generate real testimonials later?
Or are all the testimonials phony and always have been?
If I knew the answers to those questions I could better evaluate all the arguments in these comments.
If none of us know the answers, do we know enough to argue?
Sites like this take away much more than they add. The page is not built for the purpose connecting parrot lovers to information about parrots, rather it’s fine-tuned to take advantage of parrot lovers who aren’t Internet-savvy and can’t tell the difference between a legitimate website and spam. It poisons the well for those who are creating legitimate, honest, and straightforward business-to-customer websites. I can usually tell the difference, but apparently a lot of people are going to have to get burned a few times before they learn that the Internet contains this garbage.
There’s not much worse you could do for the economy as a whole than to create a slimeball site and trick people into paying you much more than you deserve.
Ryan, you have provided very very good description of this site. I wonder why Bob didn’t notice it.
Well, this article certainly brought out the socialists. It’s really astonishing how naïve some of you are. Like Bob said, parrotsecrets.com is no different than Betty Crocker, in the sense they both have a fictitious advertising spokesperson. According to the way some of you think, that means General Mills is a scam. Apparently, to the same group, BMW must be a scam, too, since they sell automobiles for high prices that do the same thing less expensive automobiles do, which is basically just transport you from one location to another.
The beauty of free market capitalism is you can decide what product to sell, at what price, and let the market decide if you offer value. Some people find value in General Mills and BMW products, and some people don’t. But at least the people made that decision, and not some incompetent market bureaucracy. That’s been tried, failed, and is one reason why the Soviet Union is in the dustbin of history.
Parrotsecrets.com offers a product for sale, people buy it, and the majority who bought it were satisfied with their purchase. A search on Google (parrotsecrets.com scam) produces a total of 65 hits, of which most are not even complaints. Rip-off Report has one complaint. If what parrotsecrets.com offered had little value and was truly unsatisfactory, there would be thousands of complaints, but there isn’t.
As for the nancyrichards.org website, I find the existence of this site suspicious, since there are so few other complaints on the internet. I suspect this is really a grudge site; the owner of the site has some kind of grudge against the owner of parrotsecrets.com.
Mr or Ms Cloudsandskye,
If you read our site nancyrichards.org you should find sufficient links and information that build evidence showing Sumantra Roy is a scammer. Most complaints by others are submitted to ripoffreport.com to which we have a link. Please read our section “links showing scamming.”
We are not a site that takes complaints. We document and keep up with the evidence. We highlight the tools Sumantra Roy uses to promote his scamming business. His’ is NOT a straight and fair internet business, like the one where you like to buy your books (Amazon.com) or sell your stuff (ebay.com).
Sumantra Roy has been trying since 2001, but he still is not a successful SEO. He only is a successful scammer:
He may sell an ebook, but he also sells a membership to sites that don’t exist (scam).
You cannot unsubscribe from his email list (spam).
Thank you Cringlely for showing everything that is wrong with our current economic system rolled up into a short anecdotal blog post.
Derivative product, check.
Shady marketing, check.
Almost zero value creation, check.
Hostility towards any ‘anti-capitalists’ who take issue with manipulating consumers and outright predation of the less abled, and I quote: “Parrotsecrets target audience, which are older women stuck with (or thinking about getting) naughty parrots”…… CHECK, and MATE.
——-
Now, to be a realist, if you are struggling to keep your home with 3 kids and you’ve got no options, then rule of the jungle is do what you need to do. Get your hustle on, as it were. But don’t mistake this for ‘entrepreneurship’. This is hustling. If needed, take it as a means to an end, pay for school, health insurance, whatever, and then do something to create VALUE.
——-
One last thing which struck a nerve. Mentioning he is from India and apparently somewhat well off, having two parents who are medical doctors (and providing real value), was the icing on the cake for me. What a waste of life, sigh. Hope his parents are proud.
[...] Secrets The only reason I’m willing to point it out as a scam is that a blogger was kind enough to break down the money made from this site and the hows and whys of its … I suppose it is an excellent example of how to make money on the internet with little overhead, [...]
[...] I can’t tell you how to do it, becuase I haven’t done it…YET. But here is a story about a entrepreneur that wrote a book called parrot secrets and he is raking in $400K per year. [...]
Who are you guys to say what adds value and what doesn’t ? What if the guy spent thousands on advertising ? Isn’t this “added value”, in the sense that it’s now easier for the consumer to find the product ?
Put it this way, would you rather spend three days looking for a parrot book, and find one for $20, or spend 3 minutes and find the same product for $30 ? You might say that the $30 book doesn’t add value compared to the $20 one, but those $10 just saved you three days.
How hard is it to find a parrot book using the Web? Have you checked?
http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=parrot+book
Do the spam emails you get every day about Viagra add value?
Bob
Next thing you will be telling me that Sara Lee isn’t out the back whipping up scrumptious cakes and goodies for us to enjoy.
OK, so my wife (who is an educator) and I brainstormed some ideas around potential markets and have already come up with our name (drat, URL already taken), our mind map etc. We looked to the interests of our 6 year old son for inspiration.
Thanks Bob – will be sure to send you a free copy once we get it produced.
While reading this article and immediately upon finishing it, one could feel excited and motivated to take action. The article even makes you think that you have the “action plan” and the details that you need to follow. However, once you really try to take action upon the information presented in this article, you may become frustrated and suffer from feelings of inadequacy because things will not work for you in the same way described here.
Making money online requires fine skills that are acquired through research, learning, trying and failing. It requires a certain level of technical skills and a high level of skill in copywriting and marketing.
It’s great that books and articles like this motivate readers and get them to realize that there are money making opportunities outside the cubicle. But it would’ve been better if these resources could motivate readers without conveying such a false image about online money making being almost easy.
Mohammed, You are one of the few commenters who has an added point to make along with Bob’s example. Perhaps he could have chosen a better example for the naive among us. However as it has been repeatedly pointed out. The basic premise holds true provided you have done the necessary foot work, which you have summarized. Our daughter has just recently quit working for an Internet company start-up that could, by some of the children’s comments on Bob’s article be defined as not adding value to the web only repackaging already available information. She quit not because of the company was tricking or being deceitful but because she is working 12 hours a day for weeks and weeks at less that what a service worker at McDonalds makes.
I think Mohammed’s point is there is a hidden amount of work that exists, regardless.
[...] Continue reading here: I, Cringely » Blog Archive » Parrot Secrets – Cringely on technology [...]
All I can say is thank you! You have exposed in more detail than I ever could, something that has been a problem for this professional parrot trainer for some time now.
I am one of the people who books, magazine and DVD’s were likely bought to fuel this person’s income. When I create a product it is based on my twenty years in the business as a professional animal trainer. I produce product to help people with parrots and yes, to make a living doing something I enjoy.
Plagiarism and copyright infringement of professional trainer’s parrot training information has in recent years become rampant. I worked very hard to earn my credentials, and as you can imagine, someone else earning a living off of my materials without proper reference to me is not in my opinion an acceptable business practice. I think anyone would feel the same if it was their materials plagiarized.
The list of offenses of niche marketers targeting the parrot community is quite long. And the person mentioned here is not the only one who uses such tactics. These unethical practices actually inspired me to decide just what are my ethics…. as I market via the internet too. What will I do and not do to make a living? http://www.goodbirdinc.com/help-Internet_Marketing_Position_Statement.html
I am in agreement with many others here. I support people making a living. I think marketing is an important tool…however I also think it can be done with integrity.
Barbara Heidenreich
Good Bird Inc
P.S. In response to a comment….I can attest the testimonials are phony. The same ones are used for every site, except the species of parrot is changed. All other words including names in the testimonials are the same
If your level of expertise is so high, it should be no problem for you to write a better book and sell it for $69 instead of $79. Just think…you can be raking in hundreds of thousands soon, too.
Sounds like you’re just frustrated and jealous.
Actually, Barbara Heidenreich is a very well-known person in the parrot community. She is one of the best known parrot behaviourists, and is an author to both books and DVDs. I highly doubt she is “just jealous”.
[...] Cringely. He’s actually quite famous in the Internet world. Here is the link to the article – "Parrot Secrets". There are some interesting views in the comments to the article – both for and against the [...]
“Nathalie Roberts (“A Parrot Lover For The Last 12 Years”) is like Betty Crocker – a character created to market a product. If you are offended by the idea that Nathalie isn’t real, then start boycotting cake mixes, kids”
General Mills does not claim or imply that Betty Crocker makes the cake mix or other products under the Betty Crocker brand. Betty Crocker is just a brand. Nathalie Roberts (“A Parrot Lover For The Last 12 Years”) appears to be an outright lie. You can dice the marketing nuances all you want but it doesn’t change the fact that it is a lie, and at best, misleading. I also doubt that the testimonials on the site are real. The end does not justify the means.
All of this is probably of no regard if those buying the ebook are satisfied. After all, no one is forcing the purchase. What I find disturbing, is that Mark Stephens (Cringely) finds nothing wrong with this. It leaves me feeling let down, like someone whose views and opinions I value, has just condoned something that is misleading, simply because it is clever and makes money.
Thanks for the use of the soapbox.
Pogo (not my real name)
Would “get rich quick” be such an attractive concept if “trapped in poverty” was not so common?
Most Web 2.0 apps are fun but useless and create no new wealth.
New Wealth. Food, shelter, durable goods.
Who gives a f**k about the internet when you can’t pay your bills?
Let’s all go to the library and look at Monster and then take a bum shower before our next interview.
I, Cringely » Blog Archive » Parrot Secrets – Cringely on technology…
…
For shame, RXC.
I work in a large ad agency and this parrot guy’s deceptions are small potatoes. Women in our shampoo ads use a different kind of better shampoo before the shooting. Then we digitally enhance their hair in post-production. All marketing operates on deception, beginning withe exclusive use of beautiful people in ads.
Think of the marketing’s greatest legends: DeBeers “A diamond is forever” while controlling supply to create fake demand; Nike “Just Do It” using glam athletes to sell mediocre shoes sewn in sweatshops; Marlboro cowboys who then died of cancer; Wal-Mart’s patriotic “Made in America” campaign while they were the world’s single biggest importer of Chinese goods; James Frey’s “memoir”; Bush telling us that Saddam was behind 9/11.
The internet is full of scams, real ones that steal outright and destroy lives via identity theft. The parrot guy is taking the low road, but he’s selling something real. I’m willing to bet his customer satisfaction rate is higher than that of Comcast, TicketMaster, Bank of America, and Microsoft. And anyone is free to spend 10k to write a better parrot e-book, market it more honestly, and charge $30. Any takers? Didn’t think so.
I bet many of the complainers here are bitterly jealous, comparatively lazy, and secretly irked that he’s a foreigner. If parrotsecrets was created by a 45-year old mother of three in Iowa City, there’d be a lot less attacking.
Now I’m off to drink a Budweiser. Doing so makes me a patriot and attracts women in bikinis.
So, to summarize your comment: It’s okay because lots of big companies do it too, and you’re all a bunch of jealous racists.
Very insightful.
Actually I’m not sure it’s ok at all. And as I work in the pit of it, the question bothers me daily. I just feel that if we really find Parrot-boy to be a criminal, then we’d do well to turn the lens on much of our consumer trade. The FTCs of various countries are entrusted with the task of determining the line between marketing and deception — it is illegal to make unverified medical claims, for instance, but legal to digitally enhance a woman’s hair in a shampoo ad. Much of the debate here is about what side of the line Parrot-boy is on. The fake testimonials should be illegal, in my opinion. But they’re not. Doctored testimonials are used by lots of companies. I have written fake testimonials for our clients, and I find it disgusting. The creation of a fake character is also legal, but I find it pretty unethical if it’s being passed off as a real person. Like I said, this guy took the low road. But those attacking him seem to find him exceptional in his transgressions. My post was just meant to say that it’s unexceptional, and that if we find it wrong we should all be vowing to fight this kind of deception daily against the bombardment of marketing that constitutes modern life. I would have liked to have seen the negative posters acknowledge this point.
Hope this sounds less “jingoistic and cranky.” I don’t even work in the United States.
As jingoistic and cranky as WLH sounds, I admit to agreeing with most of his post. Not so much the jealous and lazy parts, but the idea that you mail a check and get a book about training your bird is pretty much the bargain struck for the product delivered.
What are you hoping for, a pretty story? Well that’s there too, and for free. The thing is there are hidden stories behind most products, stuff you maybe don’t want to know about. A kid sitting at home in India with a pile of books from Amazon is at least a little better than meat packing stories or child labor stitching together Martha Stewart products or tales from the strip mines that provide the coal for your electricity. If you need to think that the organic chicken available at Whole Foods was raised in the sunshine near a brook where he played with his woodland friends until he died in his sleep, well you probably shouldn’t ask around too much.
If the provenance of a product matters to you, well this is clearly a downer, but most products are fairly commoditized and people aren’t emotionally invested in them. I guess this idea works best where folks are willing to emotionally invest, and at that point they might be more disappointed than usual to find out the truth. So let that be a lesson to any parrottrainer webmaster types: write a good ebook so the customer doesn’t bother coming back looking for you.
Bloody hell!
How the **** am I supposed to trust Cringely after this. Perhaps that mortgage advisory site he’s involved in is just a “brand” too! Maybe it’s all a bunch of second-hand usenet posts Cringely’s found and “repurposed”.
Poor saps, they don’t get it, do they? Who cares about a lie here, a deception there. It’s all ok, provided you make a few bucks, but honestly, so to speak, the more, the better. Just make sure you don’t get caught. But not to worry, even if you do, and some fool calls you out, just keep on going, there is a sucker born every minute, and the end justifies the means, right? Everybody does it, so it surely must be ok. Who cares about morals, ethics and such obsolete things, beyond the greater fools who have not yet figured out how the scam, I mean the system, works?
After reading these comments it never ceases to amaze me how uptight and self righteous people are about these things. If all those people were really concerned about others and took a little bit of the time and money they spend criticizing these things to contribute to society we’d be living in a utopia!
Hey, I’m not real either (Typing lover for 12 years)
I looked up ParrotSecrets.com at the Better Business Bureau and they have an “F” rating because they are a scam.
http://westflorida.bbb.org/WWWRoot/Report.aspx?site=47&bbb=0653&firm=90039494